how do u get more than 25mm ?

[navdog_d40]

hey guys went down to the local shop today

can someone let me know what they mean by a 2'' lift

iv had a bloke tell me he can and will lift my nav 2'' all round
and iv had another guy tell me today i would be lucky to get 25mm up in the front because of the control arm...??? so whats the go can someone explain that to me a little bit better cheers

 

[d40ryan]

lots of people b1tch about the control arms but there not the actual issue unless your trying to push 4" under the front then you will have coil contact with the upper arm, which is only cause by the manner in which it is installed where the use of a lift and a spacer at the same time giving you the full range of movement from the shock absorber and the upper control arm being 2" lower then without a spacer, it more about the stress on the cv's and what not. 2"s is fine as it will bring the lower control arm to level with the crossm ember or a bit lower which is fine and will cause no damage but will require a wheel alignment,

only lifting the front 25mm probably comes down to legality of which ever state your in and the persn selling it trying to play it safe, either way go for a lift that quotes 50mm which is the 2". but with that being said its not a garentee that it will be 2" it could be more could be less, but its highly unlikely to install a 2" lift and only gain 25mm
whoever said your LUCKY to get 25mm was speaking shit.

 

[navdog_d40]

thanks for that mate yeah i was quite confused when he told me ... and im not going to pay someone 1700 bucks to install a 2''lift if its a only 25mm lift ... he really seemed like he dint not what he was talking about ...

this other bloke said he can do it , so maybe ill just go to him although he was a little more pricey ...

but he said 2'' lift with 33's will do the trick without any spacers but i kinda wanted the spacers for more high again but he said there no good ... so that another thing i really want to get close to 3'' without body blocks but he will only do a 2'' kit not a 3''

 

[d40ryan]

cant run 33's with just a 2" lift safely theyll scrub on the back, 31's are fine
if you want to run 33's youll need to go to spacers and upper control arms or a bodylift and heat gun the guard's. body lift is quite cheap and not very hard to do.

what suspension kits were you looking at? im currently running the ironman kit which is 50mm, had it in for 4 months now no sag, cost roughly 1200 for parts.

 

[navdog_d40]

im thinking of going dobinsons suspension 2''lift kit ..i want 33's but he thinks they will fit.. i duno he told me not to use body blocks and told me not to use spacers . so confused i want a big lift with big 33's

 

[nathand22]

There are people on here that are running 33's with only a 2" lift. they just had to trim the guards and use the heat gun to massage the inner plastic guard.
Hang on i will find the link...........

Here it is..
http://www.navara.asia/showthread.php?t=11289

 

[nathand22]

oh and if you do want to go more then two inch lift then you will need to change the UCA and Sossel is selling good arms (for $550 i think) that have been tested by a few people on here that say they work great, and give you 65mm of down travel.
which is really important if you want to make it a capable 4x4, because the higher you go the less down travel you will have, the less flex you get the more time you spend with the wheels in the air = go no where

 

[d40ryan]

There are people on here that are running 33's with only a 2" lift. they just had to trim the guards and use the heat gun to massage the inner plastic guard.
Hang on i will find the link...........

Here it is..
http://www.navara.asia/showthread.php?t=11289

yeh ive seen that, but personally with the 2inch lift and body i still had to chomp most of the metal out to compensate for flex.

 

[d40ryan]

oh and if you do want to go more then two inch lift then you will need to change the UCA and Sossel is selling good arms (for $550 i think) that have been tested by a few people on here that say they work great, and give you 65mm of down travel.
which is really important if you want to make it a capable 4x4, because the higher you go the less down travel you will have, the less flex you get the more time you spend with the wheels in the air = go no where

wouldnt the flex be the same, the only difference would be you have coil hat contact without the new uca's. and in hitting the coil hat would mean youve already got more down travel then not having them in as you cant hit the coil hat without the spacers and therefore your wheels on the ground longer?

your wheels will eventually lift regardless, no hole is exactly 2 or 4 inches deep.

the only thing is that you will "feel" is the flex more as theres no down travel and one side will be driving straight in while the other side is using uptravel as opposed to them working at the same time one going up and one going down

also a locker would solve the wheel in the air issue.

either way the uca's are a must/really good idea for that extra downtravel although iim assuming they would put alot of extra stress on the cv's if used roughly as there way out of the factory limits.

sorry i just didnt agree with that last bit.

 

[nathand22]

wouldnt the flex be the same, the only difference would be you have coil hat contact without the new uca's. and in hitting the coil hat would mean youve already got more down travel then not having them in as you cant hit the coil hat without the spacers and therefore your wheels on the ground longer?

your wheels will eventually lift regardless, no hole is exactly 2 or 4 inches deep.

the only thing is that you will "feel" is the flex more as theres no down travel and one side will be driving straight in while the other side is using uptravel as opposed to them working at the same time one going up and one going down

also a locker would solve the wheel in the air issue.

either way the uca's are a must/really good idea for that extra downtravel although iim assuming they would put alot of extra stress on the cv's if used roughly as there way out of the factory limits.

sorry i just didnt agree with that last bit.

Well you are confused.
the car only has a certain amount of travel from factory, by adding a lift you do not and can not create more travel, all you are doing is raising the car up higher into the set amount of travel you have.
Flex is not all about how high the wheel can travel its also about how far is can drop.
one reason fro coil bucket hit is the shocks are a little to long, when Ultimate first did my lift, they said if i get coil bucket hitting they would shorten my shocks a little.
The arms the "Sossel is selling have bump stops on them to stop them from travelling to far therefore limiting the chance of both ball joint and cv damage.

 

[navdog_d40]

There are people on here that are running 33's with only a 2" lift. they just had to trim the guards and use the heat gun to massage the inner plastic guard.
Hang on i will find the link...........

Here it is..
http://www.navara.asia/showthread.php?t=11289

thanks for all the info mate been really helpful do u have the uca in your nav?

 

[nathand22]

thanks for all the info mate been really helpful do u have the uca in your nav?

Not yet, but will be ordering a set in the next couple of weeks along with a front "E-LOCKER"

 

[navdog_d40]

u installing the e-locker yourself how much did it set u back

 

[nathand22]

Havnt bought it yet but have been quote $1400, and $400 for fitting, BUT if it looks like a can get the time i think i will do it myself , if not i will just cop the $400 and get it done.

 

[d40ryan]

yeh i didnt know the arm's had bump stops but regardless its still going out of the factory line if its gaining an extra 65mm which will cause extra stress. your using something to make something do what its not suppose to.but anywho im pro uca's and will be installing them once i get some cash.

the bit i dont get is the flex bit your maximum flex will always be the same without the arms.

essentially max flex is dropping on wheel to max down travel while having the other at maximum up travel yes?

so using the scenario of say 4" of travel (hypothetical scenario)

using a 2"lift and 2"spacers will have you at max down travel

using just a 2 inch lift will have you somewhere in the middle

ok so now you drive into a hole that drops 2"on one side and rises 2" on the other

lift plus spacers has no downtravel so one wheel will stay at max down travel while the other wheel will go up 4" causeing the travel to be the angle of o-4" which is say 20 degrees of flex

with a 2" lift you will have one wheel drop 2" then the other would raise 2" from where they where causeing the travel to be 0-4" between which is 20 degrees of flex

so therefore the flex is exactly the same
the only difference is the ride height between them which means youll have a better ramp up/over and departure angle

i hope that clears up where im coming from?

 

[nathand22]

yeh i didnt know the arm's had bump stops but regardless its still going out of the factory line if its gaining an extra 65mm which will cause extra stress. your using something to make something do what its not suppose to.but anywho im pro uca's and will be installing them once i get some cash.

the bit i dont get is the flex bit your maximum flex will always be the same without the arms.

essentially max flex is dropping on wheel to max down travel while having the other at maximum up travel yes?

so using the scenario of say 4" of travel (hypothetical scenario)

using a 2"lift and 2"spacers will have you at max down travel

using just a 2 inch lift will have you somewhere in the middle

ok so now you drive into a hole that drops 2"on one side and rises 2" on the other

lift plus spacers has no downtravel so one wheel will stay at max down travel while the other wheel will go up 4" causeing the travel to be the angle of o-4" which is say 20 degrees of flex

with a 2" lift you will have one wheel drop 2" then the other would raise 2" from where they where causeing the travel to be 0-4" between which is 20 degrees of flex

so therefore the flex is exactly the same
the only difference is the ride height between them which means youll have a better ramp up/over and departure angle

i hope that clears up where im coming from?

You dont gain an "EXTRA" 65mm of down travel you end up with a total of 65mm.
So with a little more down travel you have gained a little ability for the ute to flex.
Also if you disconnect the sway bar, the ute will stay a bit more level when its flexed allowing the wheel to go further up into the guard, therefore utilising the full range of movement in the front end.

 

[navdog_d40]

Havnt bought it yet but have been quote $1400, and $400 for fitting, BUT if it looks like a can get the time i think i will do it myself , if not i will just cop the $400 and get it done.

ok cool sounds good so u have a rear locker as well or u going to run the e-locker first where do u live ? i live in vic getting someone to install it down here ? i don't trust myself with things like that ..

also with the uca can you use the bigger arm with a 2'' lift of is it only worth getting bigger arms if your going higher than 2''?

 

[d40ryan]

You dont gain an "EXTRA" 65mm of down travel you end up with a total of 65mm.
So with a little more down travel you have gained a little ability for the ute to flex.
Also if you disconnect the sway bar, the ute will stay a bit more level when its flexed allowing the wheel to go further up into the guard, therefore utilising the full range of movement in the front end.

thankyou for clearing that up, you never said a total of 65mm it was worded as if you gained another 65mm from where you were with the spacers and lift.

that was never the issue, the issue was with the flex statement where flex was different with or without spacers which it isnt like i said.
(nothing to do with the control arms)

anyways enough of this chat, thankyou for your input mate in helping me clear some things up, hopefully we didnt send this poor bloke on to much of a head spin. i look forward to nit picking with you again some time

 

[d40ryan]

ok cool sounds good so u have a rear locker as well or u going to run the e-locker first where do u live ? i live in vic getting someone to install it down here ? i don't trust myself with things like that ..

also with the uca can you use the bigger arm with a 2'' lift of is it only worth getting bigger arms if your going higher than 2''?

only worth it if your going over 2" as it will stop the contact by giving you a little more room.

 

[nathand22]

thankyou for clearing that up, you never said a total of 65mm it was worded as if you gained another 65mm from where you were with the spacers and lift.

that was never the issue, the issue was with the flex statement where flex was different with or without spacers which it isnt like i said.
(nothing to do with the control arms)

anyways enough of this chat, thankyou for your input mate in helping me clear some things up, hopefully we didnt send this poor bloke on to much of a head spin. i look forward to nit picking with you again some time

Oh ok now i see where you are coming from, i fully agree.
I didnt mean you gain flex from spacers or a lift, i was only talking about the UCA's